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'A Man in Illinois Has No Father Rights': Patch Comments of the Week

"Wanted for Child Support" post prompts vigorous debate on the south suburban Patch network.

In response to the post , several Patch commenters took issue with the way the system treats men.

writes:

"If you are a man in Illinois, you have absolutely no father rights. Courts are so pro-woman it isn't even funny. Equality my pink butt."

writes:

"How about posting the pictures and address of the vindictive, selfish, scorned "Ex" who continue to take the non-custodial parents to court who paid in excess of support owed??? Instead of wasting the taxpayers' and court system's time, and padding the bank accounts of these low life legalized thiefs they call "Divorce Attorneys"?

And writes:

 "The article lists a woman, as well. There are many horror stories when it comes to child support issues and the governments way of dealing with it, and these stories come from both sides, and male and female alike. This is why positive change never occurs, everyone forgets THE most important thing. It's about the children."

Kimberly April 15, 2012 at 01:41 PM
'A Man in Illinois Has No Father Rights' Now I don't have any experience personally, but to say No Rights??? In 1977, my brother fought for and won custody of his two children, ages 1 and 2. Did it cost a lot of money? Yes, it did, but any time you go to court, requiring counsel, it costs a lot of money. My guess (and its only a guess) is that it would be easier today for a man then it was 35 years ago. There is a huge difference in not being able to provide support for your child/children and not wanting to ..... I'll never understand the not wanting to part.
voklst April 15, 2012 at 05:58 PM
I am a female and YES men have no rights in Cook + Dupage counties. My husband never missed one payment to his ex-wife for his two daughters yet her cousin convinced her that my husbands wages needed to ge garnished! His ex declined into stage 4 cancer. The cousin not only received her disability check but both of the kids Soc Sec monies. The cousin Smiled at my husband and stated, "I'm raising YOUR children" we could've gotten a lawyer-with what money- we were paying child support! We had to live with my mom-we couldn't afford rent. And yes we were both working at good jobs! So in May 2011 my husbands ex died. Whata a shame! She was a full- blown diabetic who refused to take care of herself-wouldnt take her shots or high blood pressure medicine. She went blind 2 yrs before she told anyone and caused over $210,000.00 in the apartment fire where she lived. The kids were forced to live in filth and squallor and MOLD! We were not the only ones to call the DCFS and the police. And still the courts said, "She's the mom we really don't see a problem" DCFS had see worse (no feces or cockroaches yet) and the police said, "you just want those kids" YES exactly! Now the kids get straight A's, live in a clean environment are dressed well and eat well! What goes around comes around! Men have No parental rights in Illinois until the wife gives us her kids or she dies of natural causes! Voklst@yahoo.com
voklst April 15, 2012 at 06:10 PM
Oh we did try to go in 'Pro Se' w/o an attorney in Dupage* since could not afford one. It's on all court documents. The judge told us we could Not represent ourselves and to come back when we hired an attorney. Our lawyer did nothing for us for $8900.00 my husbands ex-wife attorney did everything for her for $32,000.00. Shouldn't that all have gone in trust to the kids! But someone has to pay for all those taxes and wonderful bldgs. At least when I pay to get my car fixed it actually gets fixed. We only got the visitation we were entitled to. But now due to Karma the world is our oyster with 2 beautiful daughters who have it made and are spoiled. There is a God and He does not reside in the Cook County or Dupage court system. Voklst@yahoo.com
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:11 PM
A concerned citizens I write to you as a fellow progressive that served a mental health practitioner and long time advocate for CHOICE! Having worked in the field of psychology I have had to approach the unique challenge of providing therapeutic intervention for men whose psychological distress is directly linked to feelings of powerlessness as it relates to family and reproductive decision making. I have stood along side men in the trenches that have defended with great passion our right to "choose". That is... the same men that fight so passionately for our rights have begun to on some level wonder why their voice in the discussion related to reproductive rights not even be heard in the discussion. I must admit that I have begun to evolve on this issue in a way that is more consistent with an old quote made by Karen Decrow of NOW.. "Justice therefore dictates that if a woman makes a unilateral decision to bring pregnancy to term, and the biological father does not, and cannot, share in this decision, he should not be liable for 21 years of support. Or, put another way, autonomous women making independent decisions about their lives should not expect men to finance their choice." -- Karen DeCrow, former NOW President ( National Organization for Women, U.S.A.)
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:12 PM
As I see the pro-life crowd amp up their attacks I cannot help but wonder howmany potential allies in the defense of roe v wade we have alienated by not including mens voice in the conversation on some level. I have included an article that a student forwarded me that I am still working through. Please take a read as I have found the article extremely interesting. In 2007, my nephew (19 at the time) committed suicide after a woman 7 years his senior admitted to pregnancy entrapment (contraception tampering) He was to attend college in the Fall but instead was served with CS orders. Absent the ability to prove in public what this woman admitted to in private my nephew was told to simply "man up" by the courts. After two years of depression his suicide note read... "I cannot believe this has happened. Some days are better than others, but I have decided that I would rather die than to continue to support - - - - . My entire life has been turned upside down and I pray that God recives me with understanding".This has made it very personal for me.
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:14 PM
What I find most intriguing about the "war on women" is that I keep finding myself as twenty year choice advocate being perplexed by this dicussion. I work in community health. It is hard to ignore the statistics that 70% of our children are born to unwed mothers. Many of the very women for whom I have advocated for years don not even value or exercise the responsibility (use of birth control) that comes with complete control over reproduction pre and post conception. I am personally insulted by the suggestion of a war on women while we as black women continue to enjoy the right to complete control over reproductive decsions while abdicating ourselves of complete resonsibility that comes with it. With 20+ options for preventing pregnancy there is no reason for this statistic to be so high. What is disturbing is that we are marching in the streets regarding the assault on black men while I am (right now!) watching the police escort an unemployed neighbor to jail...not for robbery or assault but for his inability to pay child support! Listen I am a choice advocate but I am evolving in my beliefe that the very men that have stood in the trenches alongside me in defense of a womans right to choose would not even have their reproductive rights taken into consideration. Here is the hypocrisy as best illustrated in this cartoon http://www.tastymojo.com/LouisvilleMojo/photos_pgp/093/PG7432020080109062112593093.jpg
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:18 PM
Motherhood is a CHOICE in 2012 and we have alienated many potential male allies that do not desire to take that choice away but desire to simply have equal treatment under the law.You see by focusing on condom use and post-conception responsibility it focuses on male responsibility or lack of and absolves us of any responsibility for the personal choices that we made. When men “walk away” we refer to them as deadbeats but the top three reasons that they walk away are the very same reasons that women put their children up for adoption or abort. We dont refer to women as deadbeats for “abandoning” the responsibility that comes with conception but we extend compassion to our girls and women about the options they have should they not be in an ideal financial situation, relationship or the potential impact on career. Do we not believe that men experience the same anxieties and fears and can be impacted in a such a way as well? As one that has worked in community mental health and in private practice with men whose pain has often been dismissed and/or completely invisible to society I think its time we begin exploring these issues. I fought as have other women, too hard for a womans right to choose, while most simply enjoy the rights without responsibility.
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:20 PM
Here is the hypocrisy as best illustrated in this cartoon http://www.tastymojo.com/LouisvilleMojo/photos_pgp/093/PG7432020080109062112593093.jpg
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:21 PM
There has been a war on our men and I will simply say that a community that despises its men run the risk of creating a community of despicable men. I watched coverage of the crisis in Syria a couple of days ago. As is common practice in western journalism it was reported "20 killed including women and children" I thought little of it until my nephew of 21 years of age stated "Theres the problem right there, we get the message loud and clear; our lives are assigned different value than everyone elses." I must admit that it is hard to argue that the value we have placed on our mens lives has been reduced to their "doings" instead of value in their being.
natalie jackson ramirez April 15, 2012 at 11:24 PM
It is a very interesting dichotomy where we are vocal about our strenngth and independence while maintaining the idea of ourselves as victims of mens ill intent. The very concept of focusing our attention on condoms (male symbol of sexual (ir) responsibility) and mens behavior post conception is a blatant attempt to shift focus away from the 20+ options we have available to us to prevent unwanted pregnancies and the lack of responsibility we demonstrated pre-conception. We cannot continue to ignore the voices of our men in this discussion. We also cannot keep saying "he should keep it in his pants if he doesnt want to pay" as it undermines our efforts to protect choice. We would never support a woman being told that we'd call it a "war on women.We began emphasizing accountability for men while extending them very little compassion. This was ruthless of course and it is respecting men but not necessarily loving them. On the other hand society began to emphasize compassion for women while extending them very little accountability.. it is infantilizing and it is loving women but not necessarily respecting them. (Goldich, 2011)
Robert Rogers April 16, 2012 at 06:09 AM
A crazy woman tried to trap me with a baby and I told her that I did not want her so she got pissed and took me to child support court. She was on birth control but she stopped taking them and did not tell me.
Serge Storms April 16, 2012 at 04:24 PM
I was accused by the state of Illinois for faluire to pay child support and all my assests were frozen. I never missed a payment, as my child support is being taken out of my paycheck every two weeks. Even the state dispersement office was able to prove that I was paying. What the problem was, leading zeros in my court case number....the state looks for leading zeros where as the when you go to court there are no leading zero. What a bunch of BOZOS we have managing this state!!! I had to pay a lawyer clear it up and had a number of check bounce because of their mistake. I take care of my son, what an insult this was!
Michael Nardoni April 18, 2012 at 01:19 PM
Men are not vocal enough in large enough numbers to effect a change. Organize, protest, and vote for Pro father rights candidates.
Carrie A. April 19, 2012 at 07:09 AM
There are hundreds of Illinois groups who stand for change , have rallies , participate along side with legislatures and short of the real hardships in family domestic courtrooms / cases ( divorce , custody , visitation , child - support etc .. ) the awareness to uphold the rights of parents and children is a societal , community , state wide Emergency and lives depend on it . Mothers , Fathers Grand parents , Siblings and extended family members must stand together as a Unit and protect their traditions , values and morals against the profitable crooked system who does not care about them but they expect to be paid . The largest human tragedy of the century in our country is in family law courtrooms . Life is significant when belonging to your family . Why do the cherades of this epidemic cause harm , suffering , suicides , homicides , child drop -outs , homelessness , addictions , estrangement , hunger etc .. The change must come by people individually and collectively to protect the institution of family .
Paul May 07, 2012 at 06:47 PM
I have two children from a previous marriage in which I have full custody of. I retired from the military and raised my older two children for the last 15 years. Capitalizing on my retirement check, 90% disability check and my current job check, the judge has ordered me to pay 1800 a month for one child who is now 3 and stated the mother is not required to work. In addition to my very decorated career and spic an span clean record (with the law) the judge awarded custody to the mother only allowing me to see my princess every other weekend and pay half the day care even though the mother does not work. The mother was convicted of Domestic violence on me and my oldest daughter. She was convicted for battering a patron at a bar and having illegal narcotics on her. She had been arrested for DUI, Theft, and many other things. The judge did not even consider any of these infractions. The judge saw unedited video of the severe beatings the mother would inflict on me and ignored them. Instead, the judge was more concerned with the mothers testimony of my alleged PTSD due to sever combat tours in Iraq and Afganistan. In short, the tender years doctrine is still in play. Had i known i would face such a corrupt system in this country i would have chosen to die honorably on the battle field. Suggestions?
Richard November 29, 2012 at 05:07 PM
i love how these agencys never report the TRUE stats of mothers that out number fathers in child support reage...i wish they would create a smillar wall on mothers/women who interfier with child vistation, i bet you it would be bigger than the vietnam memorial
Richard November 29, 2012 at 06:40 PM
you are so corrrect!

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